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Post by Mac on Aug 3, 2009 19:39:39 GMT -6
For my own personal Peach playing I've encountered certain match-ups that deviate from the general Peach match-ups from SWF.
One big one for me are Zeldas. I've never beaten anyone's Zelda with Peach. It is widely aggreed upon that it's a 60-40 in Peach's favor, but I play this match like a 60-40 in Zelda's favor. I simply don't know what advantage to exploit to use that upper hand the Peach supposedly has on Zelda. She reflects my turnips, and only my fair outranges her F-smash, shutting down 90% of my approaches.
Another wierd one for me is GaW. GaW, other than MK and sorta Snake, is Peach's worst match-up being at 70-30 for GaW. Every time I've done this match, it's felt a lot closer to 50-50. Granted, there are no good GaW palyers in the area, but still. This match seems a bit easier than 70-30 for me.
And for some reason, I can't beat, and barely touch Zephron's Lucas, even though it's a 60-40 for me, and this is terribly frustrating. So frustrating that I played Lucas for the first time today to figure out what his moves were other than U-Smash.
I have the same problem with Wario too. I know nothing at all about Wario and what his moves even do other than use his bike for recovery, and I do terrible fighting Warios with any character.
But that is my personal list of "Matches to John About." MK should be banned, and Snake simply overwhelms everyone I play as.
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Post by Zephron on Aug 3, 2009 20:32:15 GMT -6
Another wierd one for me is GaW. GaW, other than MK and sorta Snake, is Peach's worst match-up being at 70-30 for GaW. Every time I've done this match, it's felt a lot closer to 50-50. Granted, there are no good GaW palyers in the area, but still. This match seems a bit easier than 70-30 for me. And for some reason, I can't beat, and barely touch Zephron's Lucas, even though it's a 60-40 for me, and this is terribly frustrating. So frustrating that I played Lucas for the first time today to figure out what his moves were other than U-Smash.
2 things.
1.) Don't feel bad. The fact you don't even know my moveset (It's slightly embarrassing, but I have a good knowledge of mostly every character's moveset.) which is a big factor. You don't know what I can dish out. That's the good thing about being a low tier. If you're competent, no one knows how to deal with you properly.
2.) The character Peach alone may be able to deal with Zelda / Lucas, but that doesn't mean your playstyle won't clash positively or negatively with the other player. Playstyle means a lot. Maybe you're not taking advantage of something normal Peach mains use, and use something else that gives you an edge over G&W, a normally hard character. This can be both a good thing and a bad thing, but the good news is it shows you are original. Mostly.
Things are going to be repetitive and similar in some fashion of everyone's play, though. After all, you're playing Peach. So you're going to play more or less like Peach.
Hope that helped / shed light on some things.
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Post by C307 on Aug 4, 2009 12:37:31 GMT -6
^^^ What he said. Zelda is easy, all of her moves are very directional and easy to avoid in top lvl play. Also her smashes are di-able (d-smash can be teched if you sdi down). Aerials are the most directional so avoid easily. Nayru's love. F-smash/fair/dair that thing. Djin's fire, avoid it/ outprioritize it. Peach is floaty so sdi'ing out of u-smash/f-smash should be easier. Use turnips, the reflected trajectory is horrid for turnips, they'll only hit if your glide tossing into zelda. Watching another player's style is most important though. As you could play one player's Zelda and win most of the time then play and different players Zelda and get 2-stocked.
Hope that clears up some Zelda stuff.
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Post by мғв.TheOgbot on Aug 4, 2009 16:16:00 GMT -6
^^^ What he said. Zelda is easy, all of her moves are very directional and easy to avoid in top lvl play. Also her smashes are di-able (d-smash can be teched if you sdi down). Aerials are the most directional so avoid easily. Nayru's love. F-smash/fair/dair that thing. Djin's fire, avoid it/ outprioritize it. Peach is floaty so sdi'ing out of u-smash/f-smash should be easier. Use turnips, the reflected trajectory is horrid for turnips, they'll only hit if your glide tossing into zelda. Watching another player's style is most important though. As you could play one player's Zelda and win most of the time then play and different players Zelda and get 2-stocked. Hope that clears up some Zelda stuff. The Peach boards disagree with a few of your points Alex...
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Post by C307 on Aug 4, 2009 19:29:16 GMT -6
U-smash is Di-able. Seen Neomagic's ness do it, i've also done it before as well.
Edit: That post was from over a year ago. A lot of things weren't as well known as they are now.
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Post by мғв.TheOgbot on Aug 4, 2009 21:38:44 GMT -6
do notice the difference in character.
Ness and Peach aren't the same in the physics engine.
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Post by Mac on Aug 4, 2009 23:33:48 GMT -6
Peach cannot DI out of Zelda's U-Smash (she's one of the few that can't). If this was possible, I'd own this match-up. The only multi-hit smash that Peach can escape from is Toon Link's F-Smash (Samus' U-Smash doesn't count cause you'd have to be a retard to get hit by all of that) only if you have exact timing and float over the second hit. Zelda's U-Smash beats out most things that Peach can even think of doing. Haven't you seen this? And with my Peach, I rely heavily on turnips and Dair. My playstyle runs into a wall when I fight Zelda. That is my problem with her. I play basically the opposite of a bait and punish playstyle with all of my characters except maybe Marth (when I verse Ike). I play aggressive. The pattern I play in with Peach is as follows:
Appraoch Options: Glide Toss Turnip -> Fair (catch if blocked)/D-Throw -> U-Tilt/F-Tilt Short Hop Turnip -> Nair 1 Inch Float Dair -> Dair/Nair/Uair/Bair/F-Tilt->U-Tilt Jump Dair -> F-Tilt -> U-Tilt Spaced Fair/Bair
Then I...: Pressure with Turnips to set up another approach Follow with Turnips and Fairs and Dairs Spontaneously F-Smash
Lastly: Repeat and hope to gimp or kill with my lack of killing moves.
This reckless style I use gets owned by textbook Zeldas. Other than the spaced fairs, it's very unsafe, but can poke through shields quite easily especially if I D-Smash somewhere and rack up mad damage fast.
My Peach doesn't really follow the guidelines set for Peach players. In fact, after studying Peach for a while now, I've found that niether me, nor Dark Peach, nor Praxis, nor KOSMOS, nor Peach Kid play the same.
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Post by badassmailman on Aug 5, 2009 8:27:28 GMT -6
im pretty sure ganondorf and falcon can SDI out of tornado. Peach can sdi out of usmash (you have 11 hits to do it, you should be able to sdi out. And by out i really mean "up." On the second to last hit, try it. Yeah, it's like sdi-ing out of foxes uair in melee to avoid the second hit--it's difficult, but it's possible
the reason zelda beats you is....im the only one that used her and i was beating you with most other characters as well.
only gw that you probably play is that one blonde dude at pnt....and i beat him with lucario (a matchup that general ends with me 2stocked)
and zeph's lucas can be scary until you realize it's lucas and if you get rid of his second jump he's fucked
all zelda can do is usmash on peach and then when you're pissed off zelda gets free dsmashes, dtilts, ftilts, farores winds (for the hell of it), kicks, and utilts
are you talking about the brawl or the melee dsmash? last i checked brawl on did like 14% or like 24% if they got hit twice. If they get hit more than that, im pretty sure they're bad. Brawl dsmash does not go with "damage racking" for some reason
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Post by Zephron on Aug 5, 2009 10:20:45 GMT -6
and zeph's lucas can be scary until you realize it's lucas and if you get rid of his second jump he's fucked
Good Luck with that. I usually go so far underneath the stage you'd have to come off with me to get rid of it. And then you're screwed. Usually. Unless you're like ROB Pit or G&W.
Plus I always have magnet pulling, zap jump (assuming you didn't get rid of the 2nd jump)
And not to mention my PKT2 goes quite the long way.
The best Mac can do with Peach and getting my second jump off is dropping a turnip right offedge. And then I can just dodge it.
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Post by badassmailman on Aug 6, 2009 0:30:26 GMT -6
and then you die cuz you pkt2 into/under the stage/too far away
any character with multiple jumps can gimp you
any character with a projectile that can either be angled or thrown in an arc can gimp you
any character with a move that hits horizontally and doesn't fall uber fast can gimp you
any character that can't do any of this can kill you fast enough that gimping isn't a problem
---story of a low tier
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Post by Mac on Aug 6, 2009 1:44:35 GMT -6
BAMM, we only fought twice. Your Zelda beat Peach, and I won the Sheik vs Sheik match. You had lost to Og's Yoshi as Zelda, then I came and beat Og's Yoshi with Peach, then we fought. After our Peach v Zelda fight. You fought Mary in a Shiek ditto, then I fought you in a Shiek ditto. After that, i went to beat a few people in Street Fighter. The we played some free-for-all matches in Balanced Brawl, and then you left around 10pm.
I remember things. We fought in normal brawl twice. Didn't do melee at all, but you'd most likely crush me in melee anyway.
And I didn't mean I use D-Smash as a damage dealer. I use it to shield poke, and to get some distance. Outside of those realms, it's useless.
And yeah, the only GaW I've really played is that blonde guys. I did mention there are no good GaW players in the area though.
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